You know have been thinking of going to Asia next year now isn't that kinda ..
won't say scarey, probably more sad.,but do any of you think alot of places will be canceled.. I mean as port stops..or as a whole trip???

Claudia:

We are booked on the Diamond for May '05 Venice to Athens. At this point, we can't be sure the cruise is a "go" as the Diamond ownership situation is up in the air. We booked this cruise a year ago, because it did NOT go as far into Asia as Istanbul. There seems to be a taboo on this board aganst discussing world affairs. But may I say that there is a possibility of a "big mess" in Southwest Asia in the near future, in which we cruisers do not want to be involved? I hope so. Without going into "the forbodden territory", I think that we shall all know a bit more in the next six weeks or so, as to how far east it is desirable to go. We'll all just have to wait and see.

Thanks,
Richard

I hope they're not cancelled.....we're suppose to be at these ports in a couple of months!!

We've been to Bangkok and Phuket before so this is so sad for us as we watch the news. We've stood right there! Such a tragedy for so many people! It sure is heart breaking.

I can't see how that area will be ready for tourism in the short term. There have been reports that airlines have cancelled flights, major hotel stock with holdings in the area are way down. The devastation is mind boggling. The disease factor is frightening as well.

Here is the report from Maritime Matters:

Richard, I don't think the thrust of Claudia's question was political, but rather the damage the earthquake and subsequent tsunamis have caused in this area of the world, and how it might affect port calls.

On the cc news, there is an article about how this event has impacted the cruise industry. For now, one ship is substituting Langkawi and Penang for Pukhet, so perhaps there was no damage in those areas. They are wonderful ports, and I really enjoyed them from the Shadow in March. I will also add that I felt completely safe in all the ports I visited in Malaysia and Thailand, and I didn't use any ship excursions. We hired taxi's every day, and really loved the warmth of these people.

Where I would be concerned is that if relief efforts are slow, you could have potential unrest among the survivors to add to the disease and famine issues. Millions are homeless. The psyche after such disaster goes into survival mode. I think it could be very unsafe.

Kathy, I think those are precisely the reasons, other than physical (docks and the like), that cruiselines will not go into these areas in the near future. For areas not affected, unfortunately, it will be a windfall, so to speak. It is very difficult for all of us to separate our genuine concern and compassion for the people of this area of the world, and our travel plans to visit them. In time, I'm sure the places that were oft visited will be restored to their former natural splendor. At least that is my hope.

I agree, Olivia. Let's hope restoration can begin quickly. It's a lofty goal, but that's what prayers are for.

The Seabourn Spirit is scheduled into Phuket in mid-January. They also have some other stops coming up in Malaysia. I wonder if they will reschedule.

We were booked on an early December Seabourn Spirit Thailand & Burma cruise which we had to cancel and shorten to a land trip due to business constraints for my husband. It was basically the same itinerary of two upcoming January & February cruises, stopping in Phuket, Ko Hong, Langawaki and more. I can only imagine they will reroute, but there is no news on their web site.
---------
Leslie

jhp:

You are correct. I addressed the wrong issue. And I addressed problems in SW Asia, instead of SE Asia as Claudia meant. News has been filtering slowly out of the ravaged area, as one would expect due to destruction of communications and distance from here. It is a very sad situation. Last time I heard, the death toll was between 100,000 and 200,000. We have donated to the relief effort, and I beg others to do the same.

As far as cruising goes, there are many unaffected ports and areas in SE Asia, and I'm sure the cruise lines will modify their itineraries accordingly for some time in the future.

Thanks,
Richard

Richard: I had to google a list of SW Asia to see what all of them were:
SOUTHWEST ASIA COUNTRIES

1.) TURKEY
2.) CYPRUS
3.) SYRIA
4.) LEBANON
5.) ISRAEL
6.) JORDAN
7.) IRAQ
8.) IRAN
9.) AFGHANISTAN
10.) KUWAIT
11.) BAHRAIN
12.) QATAR
13.) UNITED ARAB EMIRATES ( U.A.E.)
14.) OMAN
15.) YEMEN
16.) SAUDI ARABIA

Have to agree, other than UAE for Dubai, and Turkey for Istanbul (and one other port) , none of those countries are on my wish list for cruising at this time!

Yes, SW Asia used to be called the "Middle East" before that became politically incorrect. Hence the name change to SW Asia.

But back to the original question, there should be many undamaged ports in East Asia, which are to the east of the affected area. These would include those in China, Vietnam, the Philippines. The only usual SE Asian ports that will no doubt be excluded in the future are those in Thailand.

Thanks,
Richard

Any opinions on our stop in Bangkok while on WC?

Bangkok is nowhere close to being affected. The only impact you might see is that it is crowded due to being used as a staging point. Of course, your stop is still months away.

As far as I can tell, Seabourn is still scheduled for port visits in Phuket this month and next. At least, I can't find anything on their website indicating that they are skipping Phuket.

Joanna, if you look at a map of Thailand (I just did), Bangkok is way up at the top of the Gulf, whereas Phuket is out on the ocean side, totally exposed to the force of the tsunami. I have not heard of any reports of damage in Bangkok. If Phuket is on your itinerary, that could well change, and I would bet they would instead call on a port in Malaysia, which isn't too far away, that got less damage.

Thanks Marc - Joanna

Thanks Olivia - Joanna (I was a "D" geography student)

Joanna, you notice, I looked at a map. Had no idea of the geography of Thailand.

Phuket is the port I meant. Massive damage there, unfortunately. And worse, many deaths. Of the SE Asian ports traditionally visited by cruise ships, Phuket is (IMO) almost certainly to be deleted for some time to come. This is just a tragedy of major proportions. I ask again to all on this board --- please donate to the relief agencies. Money is no substitute for loss of a family member. But there are many, many lost "bread winners" over there, and I know there will be many orphans. And then, there is the problem of rebuilding lost property of homes and businesses. As TV news footage comes in, the losses appear staggering.

Thanks for the concern of all,
Richard

Here is current status of resorts around Phuket.

Here is another with similar info.

You might also want to read the message boards which have some videos of the tsunami.

Here is a story from the Phuket Gazette:

Huge progress made in Patong cleanup

The beach today appeared to have been taken back to a cleaner, more serene time.

PATONG: Just five days after the tsunami hit Patong Beach, astonishing progress has been made with the clean-up of the resort town.

Tourists are back in the water or strolling along the sand, though the view is very different from the clutter that existed before the wave hit. With no beach chairs or umbrellas, one can now look along the entire three-kilometer stretch of sand.

A few boats dot the bright blue sea, now flat calm after the massive upheaval on December 26, and gone are the troublesome jet-skis and para-sailing speedboats.

It’s quieter, too, with no vendors selling soft drinks, no motorbikes, no rental cars and no tuk-tuks to disturb the town’s new-found peace. It’s almost as though the beach has been sent back in time to 20 years ago.

On the other side of the beach road, however, the damage from the tsunami is all too evident, with huge piles of rubble dotting the landscape.

Workers from Patong Municipality are working alongside employees of local businesses cleaning up the area around their workplaces.

Sadly, many of the trees that were such a feature of the beachfront, offering welcome shade from the sun, seem fated to die. Yellowing leaves carpet the brown grass as too much salt in the ground takes its toll.

Panu Maswongsa, Marketing Director of Patong Beach Resort and Vice-President of Marketing of the Phuket Tourist Association, told the Gazette that the occupancy rate of the resort before the tsunami was about 70%, but after the wave hit, all the guests were moved to others hotels. The resort will be closed for repairs and renovation.

“The water was about waist-deep and damaged guest rooms, the generator, the swimming pool and the air conditioning, so we will be closed somewhere between a month and three months.

“I believe the damage to Patong overall is about 30% – mostly the businesses next to the beach,” K. Panu added.

Some anger is being felt in Patong about the depiction of the town by the media. A member of a Marine Security unit sent by the US Embassy in Bangkok to help with the clean-up, echoed those feelings when he said he was not happy with media, especially TV, for showing only pictures of the damage.

“Many people have been helping to clean up Patong since the first day and many employees are back at work, but the television stations still show pictures of the damage. In fact, everything looks much better now. In Patong only the [beach] road and some hotels were damaged, but the beach looks so beautiful now.

“Why don’t they update their pictures?” he asked.

In Kamala, the area of Phuket probably worst hit by the wave, the beach is also mostly clean, but infrastructural damage is much more apparent, with the large bites taken out of the beach road by the tsunami.

The area behind is a scene of devastation. The wooden school vanished when the wave smashed its way across the main road and into the village beyond. The nearby wat was also severely damaged.

Soldiers, Kamala council workers and local people are all working hard to clear up the area.

Oh, the days when it would take us weeks to get this information. On CNN today, I was watching people enjoying the beaches in Phuket, and the anchorperson was bewailing the fact that people (Westerners) were enjoying their time there when there was the remote possibility of a body washing up on shore. You have to look at this not only sensitively, but from the viewpoint of these residents/natives of Thailand for whom tourism is a great part of their GNP! They are most industrious, and so they know more than us what is the best way to proceed! They have their own ideas on what side their bread is buttered, and rise to the occassion. The reporter, who was from the area, was quite taken aback, and reminded the anchor person that though lives have been lost (many breadwinners as well), these people are survivors and move forward to do so. They just have to rebuild and move forward.

I was also interested in Penang, since that was a mentioned alternative port to Phuket, and surfed the web a bit (I was in Penang in March 2004), and I found a lot of pictures. Yes, some damage, but I was amazed at the pictures of the clean-up in progress. Huge high-rises were left intact, it was the shacks right on the water in front of them that were decimated.

I have not had the spirit yet to e-mail my former husband about the assessment of loss of fishermen in these areas where he depends on them. I have a feeling it was so great I almost don't want to hear it.

Here are some pictures from Phuket.

It think it will be amazing how quickly they get back up and running. Now more than ever they need those tourist dollars. The devastation is tremendous however the worse damage is usually done to the shacks and low quality buildings.

Also as the article above points out the Media is bent on showing the magnitude of destruction on TV. They wont show the buildings that are still standing. This media blitz can help bring in relief efforts but it can also hurt the country by scaring away the tourists. Tourists do mean lots of money for the economy.

Most of the big tourist hotels and properties will probably be back very quickly. I think we may be surprised at how little the cruise ships schedules are affected by this.

The media typically does this. We've seen it recently in Florida with the hurricane situation. During the Northridge Earthquake, it was amazing how devistated the nation thought the Los Angeles Area was - they only showed the worst situations. You have to filter what you see with other accounts of any disaster. They make their money showing the worst so that you will watch them - the more who watch, the higher they get for ad revenue

Sorry to be so blunt--

With a death toll likely to approach, if not exceed, 250,000 people and millions of people homeless, do we really have our priorities right if we're worrying how soon Phuket is going to be "OK enough" so that we can enjoy ourselves?

Bill
(a past resident of Thailand)

Bill:

I think you were missing the point. What are the preferences of the Thai residents of the Phuket area? We were just bringing out the fact, as reported in local press, that the Thai people want the tourists to return to Phuket area. There has been a large loss of life, heavily tourist, in Thailand, but they are on the road to recovery.

We have not been discussing the large level of destruction and loss of life in Sumatra, Sri Lanka, or India. Those areas will need much time to recover. As both Sri Lanka and Sumatra have been suffering from civil strife before the earthquake, it is only going to be harder to recover there.

Bill, I understand exactly what you are saying. I think the loss of life and misery caused by this to so many is a tragedy of the greatest magnitude. In the worst hit areas I imagine any family has lost a family member or a close friend. It is hard to even imagine such a catastrophe.

All I believe we are saying is that where the tourist dollars can help the locals and the country and the tourist areas are fit to accept tourists this can do nothing but help Thailand. I have had people call and ask if they should cancel a trip to Bangkok now (fall of 2005)- which of course is unaffected. Geography is not a strong point for many they hear Thailand, watch the news and think the whole country is destroyed. This can be a double hit for a country that depends on tourist dollars as a key part of their economy. The Thai people are some of the most gracious people I have met you hate to see their economy get hit on top of all they have already suffered.

If Thailand can help itself then more aid can go to the countries that need the help and cannot recover as quickly.

Bill, life goes on. If a large factory burns down with loss of life. And that plant is the lifeblood of the community, plans to rebuild are usually made immediately. The employees who survived will look forward to getting their jobs back. The same way that we tourists plan to visit the areas as soon as rehabilitation takes place.

Along the lines of Bill's comments, we had a similar (though smaller scale) situation here in Okla. City on April 19, 1995 when our Federal Building downtown was blown up, killing 169 people and injuring countless others. Our annual Arts Festival was scheduled in a nearby downtown park for April 25. After much soul searching and determining that the Festival couldn't be moved to an area at least out of sight of the tragedy on such short notice, our Mayor cancelled it for that year. A good move, I think, as not even all of the bodies had been recovered. However, other activities in areas not affected by the bombing went on in our city. And the Arts Festival returned to its downtown park location in April, 1996.

The matter of this Tsuami is a bit confusing to me. On one hand, we have relief agency representatives on TV asking visitors to stay out of the affected areas (which I understand consist of a strip of land near the coast in most areas). Yet the site posted my Mark unmistakedly shows that Phuket should be up and running very shortly. So, on one hand, I certainly wouldn't want to get in the way of the relief efforts, or go to an area with the possibility of disease from contaminated water and such, I also wouldn't want to avoid a cleaned up, rebuilt, and safe area just because a natural disaster had happened there. In that case, I would be more inclined to want to patronize that area, to further help it economically. So, it's confusing, isn't it?

I have confidence that the better cruise lines like Radisson and Silversea have the sensitivity to know when it would be disrespectful (and possibly dangerous) to return, and when it would be disrespectful NOT to return.

One thing is for sure. NOW is the time to donate to the relief efforts.

Thanks,
Richard

As I stated before. Life goes on. After a night of bombing in Manchester, England, on Dec. 22nd. 1940, I saw a sign outside a shop selling greeting cards, etc. which had windows blown out.
"Stationery, not stationary."
We still celebrated Xmas eve the next day. My great joy was having a beer or two with some folks I had pulled out of a fallen house.
Phuket will survive and we will visit again.

Thank you, Neville, for your service to the country at that time. And I am sure those South Asians will rise again.

My post (a few back)was originally A FAR lengthier post which I cut back for a number of reasons. It was so "gutted" that it was misconstrued, which is OK.

Phuket will survive and will soon prosper once again, I have no doubt. There is Mariott, Sheraton, Holiday Inn, the Dusit Group, et al who have hundreds of millions invested in Phuket. They will do the necessary repairs to the facade of idylic Phuket which will be restored in large measure due to tourist dollars and the business objectives of the multinationals involved. This is ok, too. But Phuket is like a Hollywood set, all false fronts with a lot of things going on behind the scenes.

But for those that want to "see" the real Thailand, and think that strolling around luxury resort properties in Phuket is the real Thailand, the devastation of peoples lives and homes may be missed entirely.

And Phuket, in relative terms, was spared the worst. Phuket is getting disproportionate attention because a) its a resort b) there is video because tourists have video cameras and c)IMHO and most disturbing of all, Caucasians lost their lives. (As a country we seem to get more empathetic when people that look like us die. Just look at the genocide in Darfur.)

The issue isn't whether Phuket will be open for tourist business (they will), its whether visitors will look beyond the nice facade and possibly comprehend the magnitude of the tragedy. And Phuket, as I said, is one of the less affected areas relatively.


Indonesia, and other countries, are more tragically affected and do not have the benefit of tourism that Phuket enjoys. It will take years (and billions of dollars) for these countries to recover.

"Life goes on" will be a lot more accurate for Phuket (but not true for the Phuket residents living in huts with corrugated tin roofs) than it will be for other, non-tourist affected areas in coastal areas of the Indian Ocean.

Really, how many of us world cruisers have AS OF TODAY, written a check in support of relief efforts????? What are you waiting for???? Does compassionate conservatism stop at the water's edge ????

Bill

Very true Bill and very well said. It is always the poor that suffer the most.

I agree, very well said, Bill. More to think about ...

Masaki

Well said, my friend - Joanna

Bill:

Later news reports and video footage I've seen just today now state and show that Phuket suffered major damage only in scattered areas, and Indonesia (as one example) was much harder hit. And undoubtedly in Phuket, the more substantial buildings came through much better than the modest homes and shacks lived in by the locals just off the built up tourist area. So more detailed news accounts confirm the information both you and Mark have provided.

I'll just repeat what we've both said, and that is the time to make an appropriate donation to the relief effort is now. We did so several days ago, and we are not even conservatives or on the World Cruise! :) . All who have not contributed should do so today!!!! There is even a bill being introduced in Congress to allow such charitable contributions made now to be tax deductible in 2004 --- even though made in 2005 --- to encourage contributions.

And one final comment. The need for contributions may not end quickly. After the "primary damage" to buildings and infrastructure is all repaired, I fear that this part of the world will be left with horrible "secondary damage" in the form of orphaned children, lost bread winners, lost industries and jobs, and the like. After all, in terms of immediate loss of life and property only, this is certainly the biggest natural disaster of my lifetime. It can be expected to cause continuing need. We are planning on making future donations to the relief effort, in addition to our initial one.

Won't everyone please join us?

Thanks,
Richard

Our priest asked for donations Sunday - exceeding twenty thousand dollars as of today at 3 pm - - kind, loving people!!! Joanna